2/4/03

LC030204

VAL ZAVALA>> TONIGHT ON LIFE AND TIMES --

JESS MARLOW>> A SHOT OF THE SHUTTLE YOU HAVEN’T SEEN ON TODAY’S NEWS AND IT MAY HELP US UNDERSTAND WHAT AMERICA’S ASTRONAUTS ARE UP AGAINST.

[FILM CLIP]

MARCIA SMITH>> IT’S RISKY THROUGHOUT AND SO IT TAKES VERY BRAVE PEOPLE TO DO IT, AND THE NATION NEEDS TO BEAR THAT IN MIND BECAUSE THE NATION NEEDS TO UNDERSTAND THESE RISKS SO THAT WHEN SOMETHING DOES GO WRONG, THEY KNOW HOW TO REACT.

VAL>> AND THEN WHAT’S BEHIND AMERICA’S FAVORITE PASTIME? AS IT TURNS OUT, WE MAY BE HOOKED ON THOSE FATTY FOODS FOR REASONS SCIENTISTS ARE JUST BEGINNING TO UNDERSTAND.

JESS>> PLUS, THE SHUTTLE TRAGEDY AS A HOMETOWN STORY, AND COMMENTARY FROM PATT MORRISON.

VAL>> IT’S ALL STRAIGHT AHEAD ON TONIGHT’S LIFE AND TIMES.

LIFE AND TIMES IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE FOLLOWING FOUNDATIONS:

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AND THE CALIFORNIA ENDOWMENT
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VAL>> TONIGHT A LOOK AT THE COLUMBIA TRAGEDY FROM GROUND ZERO IN TEXAS WHERE THE SHUTTLE ASTRONAUTS WERE MORE THAN JUST NAMES IN THE NEWS.

JESS>> HOUSTON WAS THEIR HOME AND TODAY THAT’S WHERE THOUSANDS GATHERED TO REMEMBER THE COLUMBIA CREW. WE’RE ABOUT TO SEE HOW ONE HOUSTON TELEVISION STATION, KHOU, COVERED THIS NATIONAL TRAGEDY AS A HOMETOWN STORY. THE STATION HAS ALSO UNCOVERED AN IMPORTANT AMATEUR VIDEO THAT MAY WELL SHED NEW LIGHT ON WHY THE SHUTTLE BROKE APART.

GREG HURST>> SEVEN AMERICAN ASTRONAUTS LOST THREE DAYS AGO WERE MOURNED AND CELEBRATED AS HEROES AS THE SEARCH FOR ANSWERS CONTINUES. GOOD EVENING, I’M GREG HURST.

LISA FARANDA>> AND I’M LISA FARANDA. THANKS FOR JOINING US. THE COLUMBIA ASTRONAUTS WERE REMEMBERED TODAY AS DARING VOYAGERS WHO LIVED THEIR DREAMS.

GREG HURST>> ELEVEN NEWS REPORTER, DAN LAUCK, HAS MORE AS THE NATION GRIEVES THE LOSS OF SEVEN HEROES.

DAN LAUCK>> LAST NIGHT, GOD HUNG A SLIVER OF A MOON IN THE SKY, THE KIND THAT INSPIRED CHILDREN TO DREAM. TODAY SEVEN OF THOSE DREAMERS THE NATION CAME TO MOURN.

GEORGE W. BUSH>> THEIR MISSION WAS ALMOST COMPLETE AND WE LOST THEM SO CLOSE TO HOME.

DAN LAUCK>> THEY WERE JUST MINUTES AWAY FROM TOUCHING DOWN, MINUTES AWAY FROM THE ARMS OF THEIR HUSBANDS AND WIVES, SONS AND DAUGHTERS, WHEN COLUMBIA BROKE APART IN THE TEXAS SKY.

CAPTAIN KENT ROMICHER>> THE WORLD LOST SEVEN HEROES. WE LOST SEVEN FAMILY MEMBERS.

DAN LAUCK>> CAPTAIN KENT ROMICHER CHOKED WITH EMOTION AS HE TALKED OF HIS FRIEND, THE COMMANDER OF THE COLUMBIA, RICK HUSBAND.

CAPTAIN KENT ROMICHER>> HIS FAVORITE SAYING, AND I CAN HEAR HIM SAYING IT RIGHT NOW, WAS “YOU KNOW, I FEEL MORE NOW LIKE I DID THAN WHEN I FIRST GOT HERE.”

DAN LAUCK>> FOR HOWEVER BRIEF, HUSBAND’S WIFE, EVELYN, AND THE PRESIDENT SHARED A SMILE.

CAPTAIN KENT ROMICHER>> RICK, WILLY, MIKE, KC, LAUREL, DAVE AND ILAN, I KNOW YOU’RE LISTENING. PLEASE KNOW YOU’RE IN OUR HEARTS.

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DAN LAUCK>> EVERY ASTRONAUT WHO EVER SET ATOP A ROCKET AND WAS SHOT INTO SPACE QUICKLY UNDERSTOOD THE RISK AND DID IT ANYWAY.

GEORGE W. BUSH>> TO LEAVE BEHIND EARTH AND AIR AND GRAVITY IS AN ANCIENT DREAM OF HUMANITY. FOR THESE SEVEN, IT WAS A DREAM FULFILLED.

DAN LAUCK>> FOR THESE SEVEN, THE BELL HAS TOLLED. BUT FROM THEIR INSPIRATION, THE DREAM LIVES ON. FOR THE FAMILIES, OF COURSE, THIS WAS A DIFFICULT DAY, PARTICULARLY DIFFICULT FOR THE CHILDREN. THE PRESIDENT SPOKE DIRECTLY TO THE CHILDREN, TELLING THEM TO ALWAYS REMEMBER THAT EVEN THOUGH THEIR MOTHERS AND FATHERS WERE NOT HERE, THEIR PARENTS ALWAYS WERE PROUD OF THEM AND ALWAYS LOVED THEM. GREG AND LISA?

GREG HURST>> AND BEHIND YOU, THE MEMORIAL CONTINUES TO GROW.

DAN LAUCK>> YES, IT DOES.

GREG HURST>> ALL RIGHT, DAN. THANKS. NASA ENGINEERS SAY FOAM AND DAMAGED TILE HAVE ALWAYS BEEN A CONCERN FOR SHUTTLE FLIGHTS. AS ELEVEN NEWS REPORTER, NANCY HOLLAND, TELLS US, THEY’RE NOW THE LEADING FOCUS IN THE COLUMBIA TRAGEDY.

>> LOOK AT THE CHUNKS COMING OFF OF IT!

NANCY HOLLAND>> AMATEUR VIDEO SHOT IN ARIZONA COULD GIVE NASA POTENTIALLY VITAL CLUES IN ITS SEARCH FOR WHAT CAUSED COLUMBIA TO DISINTEGRATE. THE SPACE AGENCY HAS REQUESTED TO VIEW THIS TAPE. IT HAS SAID THAT EVIDENCE THAT THE SHUTTLE WAS BREAKING UP BEFORE IT CROSSED INTO TEXAS COULD BE THE MOST IMPORTANT PIECE OF THE PUZZLE. IN FACT, NASA IS ALREADY RESPONDING TO REPORTS OF MATERIAL FALLING IN THE ARIZONA DESERT.

MICHAEL KOSTELNIK>> IF IT IS WING MATERIAL, OBVIOUSLY THAT WOULD BE VERY IMPORTANT TO THE INVESTIGATION. SO WITHOUT SPECULATING PRECISELY WHAT IT IS, THE SOURCES WERE CREDIBLE ENOUGH TO CAUSE US TO SEND A NASA TEAM OUT TO TAKE A LOOK.

NANCY HOLLAND>> SO FAR, EVERYTHING CONTINUES TO POINT TO A PROBLEM EIGHTY-ONE SECONDS AFTER LIFTOFF WHEN A TWO AND A HALF POUND CHUNK OF INSULATION CAME OFF THE SHUTTLE’S EXTERNAL FUEL TANK AND STRUCK THE ORBITER. NASA HAS SAID IT IS MAKING THE ASSUMPTION THAT THE TANK IS THE ROOT OF THE PROBLEM.

>> THAT’S A FAIRLY DRASTIC ASSUMPTION AND IT’S SOBERING.

NANCY HOLLAND>> THE FIFTEEN-STORY HIGH CYLINDERS ARE MANUFACTURED AT LOCKHEED MARTIN’S MICHOUD ASSEMBLY FACILITY IN NEW ORLEANS. THE FOAM INSULATION IS SPRAYED ON TO COVER THE EXTERIOR OF THE TANK. INVESTIGATORS ARE LOOKING AT WHETHER THE PIECE THAT HIT THE SHUTTLE WAS ENOUGH TO DAMAGE HEAT-RESISTANT TILES. NASA MANAGERS DIDN’T CONSIDER THAT A SIGNIFICANT THREAT. IN FACT, COLUMBIA LOST TILES AS EARLY AS ITS FIRST MISSION WHEN IT SHED A DOZEN OF THEM AND CAME HOME SAFELY.

WHAT YOU ARE LOOKING AT RIGHT NOW IS FROM SMU RESEARCHERS. THEY HAVE SOME EQUIPMENT AT BIG BEND THAT MEASURES LOW FREQUENCY SOUND. THE FIRST ONE IS THE NORMAL SOUND WHEN THE SHUTTLE GOES OVER, BUT WHAT THEY SAW THIS SATURDAY WAS NOT NORMAL. IN FACT, THEY SAY THEY DETECTED SEVEN DISTINCT BOOMS FROM WEST OF WICHITA FALLS TO EAST OF DALLAS. WHAT THEY SAY THEY BELIEVE THIS MEANS IS THAT THE ORBITER WAS INDEED COMING APART BEFORE IT EVER CROSSED OVER INTO TEXAS. GREG?

GREG HURST>> INVESTIGATORS LOOKING FOR SHUTTLE DEBRIS HAVE MADE A SIGNIFICANT FIND IN NACOGDOCHES. LET’S GET AN UPDATE NOW FROM ELEVEN NEWS REPORTERS, JEREMY DESEL, IN EAST TEXAS. JEREMY?

JEREMY DESEL>> WELL, GREG, AUTHORITIES ARE NOW TAKING A MORE PRO ACTIVE APPROACH TO TRY TO GO OUT AND FIND THIS DEBRIS. THEY’VE ACTUALLY GRIDDED OFF A 2,000-ACRE SECTION OF THE RURAL PARTS OF THIS COUNTY AND THEY MADE SOME QUICK FINDS. THEY FOUND AN INTACT SEAT, SOME OTHER CABIN COMPONENTS. THEY EVEN FOUND A COUPLE OF TANKS THAT WERE LEAKING SOME SORT OF GAS. IN ALL, THERE ARE MORE THAN 3,500 DEBRIS SITES THAT HAVE BEEN REPORTED HERE IN NACOGDOCHES COUNTY ALONE.

THERE ARE ALSO LANDOWNERS WHO ARE GETTING INTO MAKING THESE FINDS, SOME OF THEM POTENTIALLY SIGNIFICANT. LATE LAST NIGHT, CHESTER CHRISTOPHER FOUND A TEN-FOOT BY THREE-FOOT SECTION OF WHAT APPEARS TO BE THE UNDERSIDE OF THE SHUTTLE. NOW THE SECTION HAS BLACK TILES, SOME OF THEM MELTED. SOME AREAS WHERE TILES USED TO BE, THERE ARE EVEN SOME AREAS OF BARE METAL. THAT’S ALL ON ONE BIG PIECE AND IT’S A SECTION THAT WAS LUCKY TO BE FOUND.

CHESTER CHRISTOPHER>> I PRETTY MUCH KNOW THIS PROPERTY LIKE THE BACK OF MY HAND. ABOUT A HUNDRED FEET FROM WHERE THIS PANEL FELL IS A KNEE-DEEP MARSH. IF IT HAD FALLEN IN THERE, NOBODY WOULD HAVE EVER FOUND IT.

JEREMY DESEL>> THERE ARE ONE HUNDRED PRIORITY SITES THE RECOVERY CREWS HAVE TARGETED HERE IN NACOGDOCHES COUNTY AND THEY ARE TRYING TO GET TO THOSE FIRST. IN ALL, THERE ARE NINE CREWS THAT ARE NOW OUT DOING THESE RECOVERY EFFORTS AND THEY ARE WORKING AS FAST AS THEY CAN, BUT IT IS A SLOW PROCESS. AS OF NOON TODAY, ONLY THIRTY OF THOSE SITES HAVE BEEN CLEARED, ABOUT 3,500 TO GO.

JESS>> OUR THANKS AGAIN TO KHOU TELEVISION IN HOUSTON FOR ALLOWING US TO BROADCAST THEIR SPECIAL COVERAGE.

VAL>> THE SHUTTLE TRAGEDY COULD PUT A PERMANENT END TO THE NOTION OF CIVILIANS IN SPACE. EVEN WITH INTENSE SAFETY PRECAUTIONS, NOTHING IS FOOLPROOF. KCET EXPLORED THE HAZARDS A FEW YEARS AGO IN A DOCUMENTARY THAT TOOK US INSIDE THE SHUTTLE.

NARRATOR>> AND THE SHUTTLE IS STILL A VERY DANGEROUS WAY TO TRAVEL.

MARCIA SMITH>> IT’S RISKY THROUGHOUT AND SO IT TAKES VERY BRAVE PEOPLE TO DO IT, AND THE NATION NEEDS TO BEAR THAT IN MIND BECAUSE THE NATION NEEDS TO UNDERSTAND THESE RISKS SO THAT WHEN SOMETHING DOES GO WRONG, THEY KNOW HOW TO REACT. I THINK THAT, BECAUSE THE SHUTTLE HAS BEEN LAUNCHED SO SAFELY SO MANY TIMES SINCE CHALLENGER, PEOPLE ARE FORGETTING AGAIN JUST HOW RISKY IT IS.

VAL>> THAT WAS A CLIP FROM “JOHN GLENN: AMERICAN HERO”. THE PROGRAM FOCUSED ON GLENN’S RETURN TO SPACE AT AGE SEVENTY-SEVEN. THE DOCUMENTARY WAS PRODUCED BY BLAINE BAGGETT. BACK THEN, HE WAS KCET’S RESIDENT EXPERT ON SPACE. BLAINE BECAME A FINALIST IN NASA’S JOURNALIST IN SPACE PROGRAM, BUT HIS HOPES OF TRAVELING ON THE SHUTTLE ENDED IN 1986 AFTER THE CHALLENGER EXPLOSION. TONIGHT BLAINE IS HERE TO REFLECT ON THE COLUMBIA TRAGEDY AND TO SHARE HIS OWN EXPERIENCES. WELCOME AND THANKS FOR BEING HERE.

BLAINE BAGGETT>> GOOD TO BE BACK, VAL.

JESS>> GIVEN YOUR BACKGROUND AND YOUR EXPERIENCE, WHAT WERE YOUR THOUGHTS WHEN YOU LEARNED OF THE DISASTER?

BLAINE BAGGETT>> WELL, I LEARNED ON SATURDAY MORNING AROUND SEVEN O’CLOCK. I GOT A CALL AND NEARLY RAN TO LOOK AT THE TELEVISION, SAW THE VIDEO, KNEW THAT THERE COULD NOT BE ANY SURVIVORS AND, AT THAT POINT, WENT INTO ACTION MODE. I WENT TO JPL WHERE I WORK TO CALL MY COUNTERPARTS IN WASHINGTON AND SAID HOW CAN WE HELP? WHAT CAN WE DO? SO IT REALLY WASN’T REFLECTION. IT WAS MORE GETTING INTO WORK.

VAL>> NOW YOU’VE ACTUALLY BEEN THROUGH SOME OF THE TRAINING THAT THE ASTRONAUTS GO THROUGH BECAUSE, AS PART OF THE COMPETITION TO BE A JOURNALIST IN SPACE, YOU HAVE TO DO, WHAT, ZERO GRAVITY, GO ON THE SIMULATOR?

BLAINE BAGGETT>> ACTUALLY, THE EXPERIENCES I HAD HAD TO DO WHEN I WORKED ON DOCUMENTARIES ABOUT THE SPACE PROGRAM. SO THE ZERO G TRAINING, THE WORKING ON THE SHUTTLE SIMULATOR, ALL OF THAT WAS A PART OF MY DOCUMENTARY WORK. IT WASN’T PART OF THE ACTUAL COMPETITION.

VAL>> I SEE. WHAT WAS YOUR IMPRESSION IN TERMS OF THE EMPHASIS OR THE CONCERN ABOUT SAFETY, ESPECIALLY IF THEY DEALT WITH CIVILIANS?

BLAINE BAGGETT>> I’M SO GLAD YOU ASKED THAT BECAUSE I THINK IT’S SO IMPORTANT FOR THE PUBLIC TO UNDERSTAND HOW PASSIONATE NASA IS FROM TOP TO BOTTOM ABOUT SAFETY. IF YOU’VE GONE THROUGH ANY OF THEIR TRAINING, YOU KNOW THAT SAFETY IS JUST ALWAYS, ALWAYS BEING THOUGHT ABOUT.

JESS>> AND YET WE’RE TOLD THAT, BECAUSE OF COST CUTTING AND OTHER MEASURES, THERE WAS PERHAPS SOME NEGLIGENCE IN MAINTENANCE? THERE WAS CORROSION? THERE WERE TILES THAT WERE DAMAGED? APPARENTLY THAT PARTICULAR SHUTTLE, THE GRAY LADY, THE OLDEST OF THEM, WAS NOT REALLY IN GREAT SHAPE TO FLY.

BLAINE BAGGETT>> I THINK THAT REMAINS TO BE SEEN AS TO WHAT THE INVESTIGATION TURNS UP. CERTAINLY THERE ARE ALWAYS PROBLEMS WITH MECHANICAL THINGS. YOU FIX THEM. AS FAR AS I KNOW, THEY HAD FIXED ALL THE PROBLEMS THAT THEY KNEW ABOUT.

VAL>> NOW RE-ENTRY, OF COURSE, IS THE MOST DANGEROUS PART OF ALMOST ANY MISSION AND THAT HAS BEEN TRUE FOR THE ENTIRE LENGTH OF THE SPACE PROGRAM. WE’RE GOING TO TAKE A LOOK NOW AT A CLIP FROM THE DOCUMENTARY THAT YOU DID ON JOHN GLENN BACK IN 1962. HIS EXPERIENCE, AND THE VERY FRIGHTENING, EXPERIENCE HE HAD UPON RE-ENTRY. LET’S TAKE A LOOK AT THAT.

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JOHN GLENN>> ROGER. ZERO G AND I FEEL FINE. CAPSULE IS TURNING AROUND. OH, THAT VIEW IS TREMENDOUS.

NARRATOR>> YOU COULD JUST HEAR THE ENTHUSIASM IN HIS VOICE. GLENN IS AT HIS ABSOLUTE FINEST AND AT HIS HAPPIEST WHEN HE IS INVOLVED IN FLYING OR TALKING ABOUT FLYING, SO THIS WAS THE BEST OF BOTH WORLDS. BECAUSE NOT ONLY IS HE UP THERE IN THE HEAVENS, HE’S TELLING THE WORLD ABOUT IT AS WELL.

JOHN GLENN>> THE SUNSET WAS BEAUTIFUL. IT WENT DOWN VERY RAPIDLY. I STILL HAVE A BRILLIANT BLUE BAND CLEAR ACROSS THE HORIZON ALMOST COVERING MY WHOLE WINDOW.

NARRATOR>> BUT GLENN SOON HAD NO TIME TO SIGHTSEE. NEAR THE END OF THE FIRST ORBIT, ONE OF FRIENDSHIP SEVEN’S AUTOMATIC THRUSTERS BEGAN MALFUNCTIONING. THEN A SECOND ONE FAILED. NEXT HIS GYROSCOPE WENT OUT AND, ON THE GROUND, MISSION CONTROLLERS HAD AN EVEN BIGGER WORRY.

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NARRATOR>> A SIGNAL FROM THE SPACECRAFT WAS WARNING THAT FRIENDSHIP SEVEN’S HEAT SHIELD MIGHT BE LOOSE. IF THAT WERE TRUE, GLENN HAD NO WAY OF SURVIVING RE-ENTRY. HE AND HIS SPACECRAFT WOULD BURN UP IN THE ATMOSPHERE. AS FRIENDSHIP SEVEN BEGAN RE-ENTRY, FLAMES ENVELOPED THE SPACECRAFT. GLENN HEARD METALLIC SCRAPING SOUNDS AND THEN OMINOUS THUMPS. NEXT, LARGE BURNING CHUNKS OF WHAT GLENN FEARED WAS HIS HEAT SHIELD BEGAN FLYING PAST HIS WINDOW.

JOHN GLENN>> THIS IS FRIENDSHIP SEVEN. A REAL FIRE BALL OUTSIDE.

NARRATOR>> BUT GRADUALLY THE FIRE OUTSIDE SUBSIDED. THE HEAT SHIELD HAD HELD.

JOHN GLENN>> ROGER, STEELHEAD. FRIENDSHIP SEVEN. THE CHUTE LOOKS VERY GOOD, OVER.

JOHN GLENN>> IT WAS ALMOST LIKE IT WAS DESIGNED BY HOLLYWOOD. IT WASN’T, BUT IN ALL THE SUSPENSE YOU EVER COULD HAVE AND THEN THEY HAD SOME PROBLEMS IN FLIGHT AND WILL HE MAKE IT, WON’T HE MAKE IT? BUT IT WAS JUST SO DRAMATIC.

[FILM CLIP]

NARRATOR>> AFTER GLENN WAS RETRIEVED FROM THE OCEAN, HE WAS WHISKED AWAY FOR A MEDICAL EXAM TO SEE WHAT EFFECTS SPACE MIGHT HAVE HAD ON HIS BODY. THREE DAYS LATER, AIR FORCE ONE LANDED AT CAPE CANAVERAL. PRESIDENT KENNEDY HAD COME TO PAY HOMAGE ON BEHALF OF A GRATEFUL NATION.

VAL>> THAT WAS QUITE AN EXPERIENCE HE HAD. WOULD THAT HAVE BEEN THE SAME OR DIFFERENT FROM WHAT MIGHT HAVE HAPPENED WITH THE COLUMBIA CREW?

BLAINE BAGGETT>> WELL, JOHN GLENN KNEW EVEN BEFORE HE BEGAN RE-ENTRY THAT THERE WAS SOME SORT OF A PROBLEM AND WASN’T CERTAIN. HE TOLD ME, FOR INSTANCE, HE SAID I THINK I MAY BE STARTING TO FEEL THE HEAT ON MY BACK QUICKLY. BUT THE COLUMBIA CREW HAD NO WARNING WHATSOEVER.

VAL>> I SEE.

JESS>> AND NO ANXIETY?

BLAINE BAGGETT>> I DON’T THINK SO.

VAL>> AND, REAL QUICKLY, IF YOU HAD A CHANCE TO BE A JOURNALIST IN SPACE, WOULD YOU STILL BE ONE?

BLAINE BAGGETT>> WITH A ONE-YEAR-OLD (LAUGHTER). I WOULD DO IT IF I FELT I COULD GO UP AND TELL A STORY AND REALLY MAKE A DIFFERENCE THAT WOULD BE LASTING. I THINK THAT’S WHY THE ASTRONAUTS DO GO. I DON’T THINK THEY GO FOR THE JOYRIDE OF IT. I THINK THEY GO BECAUSE THEY’RE THERE TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE FOR ALL OF US.

VAL>> BLAINE BAGGETT, THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR WORK AS A DOCUMENTARIAN AND FOR BEING HERE TONIGHT.

BLAINE BAGGETT>> YOU’RE WELCOME.

JESS>> THE COLUMBIA IS LOST, BUT THE DESIRE TO EXPLORE SPACE CERTAINLY GOES ON. TONIGHT PATT MORRISON TELLS US THE ONLY REMAINING QUESTION IS WHETHER AMERICA HAS THE POLITICAL WILL TO PURSUE THIS LAST FRONTIER.

PATT MORRISON>> THE SPACE SHUTTLE COLUMBIA DISAPPEARED IN A FIREWORKS BURST OF SHOOTING STARS AS BRILLIANT AS THE GALAXIES WE EARTHLINGS WATCH SO LONGINGLY AND FEARFULLY. THE QUESTION BEING ASKED REPEATEDLY IS WHETHER THE NATION’S APPETITE FOR EXPLORATION BLEW UP ALONG WITH THE SHUTTLE. OF COURSE, IT DIDN’T. THAT’S A BATTING PRACTICE PITCH FOR POLITICIANS TO KNOW OUT OF THE PARK, BUT WILL ISN’T ALL IT TAKES TO GO INTO SPACE. IT TAKES MONEY AND NASA IS UP AGAINST THE POTEMKIN FAÇADE PHENOMENON. GOVERNMENT SETS UP BIG DEPARTMENTS, GIVES SOME BIG NAMES, BUT SOON THE ATTENTION SPAN FLAGS AND OFTEN THESE AGENCIES END UP RUNNING ON MY HEART THAN BUDGET.

NOT UNTIL 9/11 DID AGENCIES LIKE THE CIA AND THE FBI GOT EVEN THE BEGINNINGS OF REAL SCRUTINY. BY THE SAME TOKEN, NOT UNTIL COLUMBIA BLEW UP DOES NASA GET THE ATTENTION IT HAS DESERVED. ONLY A GOVERNMENT CAN DO A PROJECT ON THE SCALE OF SPACE EXPLORATION. BILL GATES AND GEORGE SOROS TOGETHER COULDN’T AFFORD IT, BUT WHEN IT COMES TO SCIENCE, GOVERNMENT IS USUALLY TIMID AND UNIMAGINATIVE, DEMANDING AN IMMEDIATE “WHAT GOOD IS IT ANYWAY” PAYOFF. SHOESTRING BUDGETS AND SPACE JUST DON’T GO TOGETHER. SPACE IS NOT EASY AND SPACE IS NOT CHEAP. YET IT’S AN EASY BUDGET TO TRIM. ASTRONAUTS AND SCIENTISTS AND STAR TREK FANS DON’T TURN OUT WITH PROTEST SIGNS WHEN NASA BUDGETS ARE ON THE LINE. MAYBE IT’S TIME THEY DID.

THE LOS ANGELES TIMES HAS REPORTED THAT, THREE YEARS AGO, NASA WAS WARNED BY HIGH-RANKING PEOPLE ABOUT SERIOUS SHUTTLE SAFETY PROBLEMS OF MAINTENANCE AND WORKMANSHIP AND UNDER-STAFFING, BUT FEW OF THE MAJOR RECOMMENDATIONS WERE CARRIED OUT. COST, SAID THE REPORT’S AUTHOR, GOT IN THE WAY. WHAT IS TRUE OF MANY AGENCIES IS TOO VIVIDLY TRUE OF NASA. JUST AS TEN CENTS OF MEDICAL CARE KEEPS PEOPLE OUT OF $10,000 SURGERIES, AND A DOLLAR SPENT ON ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION MEANS A HUNDRED DOLLARS THAT DON’T HAVE TO GO TO TOXIC CLEANUPS, TEN CENTS WORTH OF NASA MAINTENANCE COULD SAVE $10 MILLION IN CATCH-UP COSTS, NOT TO MENTION SEVEN ASTRONAUTS’ LIVES.

UNFORTUNATELY, THE SOFTBALL QUESTION THE PUNDITS HAVE BEEN ASKING IS WHETHER THE SPACE PROGRAM SHOULD CONTINUE. OF COURSE, IT SHOULD. THIS IS A COUNTRY BUILT ON TAKING CHANCES. BETTER SAFE THAN SORRY WAS NEVER OUR NATIONAL MOTTO. I’VE COVERED SEVERAL SHUTTLE LANDINGS, MANY OF THEM AS ROUTINE AS RUNWAY LANDINGS AT LAX, AND THE FACT THAT THE SHUTTLE’S HUNDRED-PLUS MISSIONS BECAME ROUTINE IS WHAT MADE THE PROGRAM GREAT AND CLASSICALLY AMERICAN BECAUSE AMERICA’S SENSE OF INVENTION HAS BEEN ABOUT MAKING THE EXTRAORDINARY INTO THE ORDINARY. TO LET GO OF THAT IS TO LET GO OF THE BETTER ANGELS IN OUR NATIONAL CHARACTER. CAN WE AFFORD TO KEEP GOING INTO SPACE? RATHER ASK HOW, IN GOOD CONSCIENCE, CAN WE AFFORD NOT TO.

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VAL>> NOW YOU MAY USE THE WORDS “HEAVY”, “STOCKY”, OR JUST PLAIN “BIG”, BUT ONE AUTHOR SAYS WAKE UP. THE WORD IS “FAT”. HE CLAIMS THAT IT’S IMPORTANT FOR AMERICA TO ADMIT THAT, SINCE WE ARE ON OUR WAY TO BECOMING THE FATTEST PEOPLE IN THE WORLD. HE ALSO HAS SOME THOUGHTS ON WHY SO MANY OF US ARE HOOKED ON ALL THE WRONG FOODS.

JESS>> WRITER GREG CRITSER KNOWS ABOUT POUNDAGE. HE ACTUALLY FORCED HIMSELF TO SLIM DOWN DURING THE COURSE OF WRITING A BOOK. IT’S CALLED “FAT LAND: HOW AMERICANS BECAME THE FATTEST PEOPLE IN THE WORLD”. GREG CRITSER JOINS US NOW TO TALK ABOUT HIS FAVORITE SUBJECT. IN RESEARCHING THIS IN YOUR OWN EXPERIENCE, IS IT ANYTHING MORE THAN SIMPLY EATING TOO MUCH OF THE WRONG THINGS AND EXERCISING TOO LITTLE?

GREG CRITSER>> IT IS, BUT IT ISN’T. THAT’S A BIG ANSWER, I GUESS. WHAT I’M TRYING TO SAY IS THAT OUR ENVIRONMENT HAS CHANGED SO PROFOUNDLY OVER THE LAST TWENTY-FIVE YEARS IN TERMS OF THE CHEAPNESS OF FOODS AND IN THE EXPENSIVENESS OF EXPENDING CALORIES. FOR MANY PEOPLE, THEY’VE LOST TOUCH OF CALORIC BALANCE AS THE TOUCHSTONE OF DIETARY AND WEIGHT CONTROL.

VAL>> NOW YOU DO A LOT OF COMPARISONS TO THE FRENCH. THAT’S VERY INTERESTING. WHERE FRANCE WAS A WHILE AGO, WE ARE NOW. EXPLAIN THAT.

GREG CRITSER>> WELL, ONE OF THE THINGS I LIKE TO COMPARE IS LOS ANGELES AT THE TURN OF THE MILLENNIUM AND PARIS AT THE TURN OF THE CENTURY. THEY ARE VERY SIMILAR. THERE WERE LARGE POPULATIONS OF RURAL PEOPLE WHO WERE POOR, WHO WERE IN THE CITY FOR THE FIRST TIME, WHO CAME FROM BACKGROUNDS OF STARVATION WHERE STARVATION WAS IN RECENT MEMORY, AND WHERE IT WAS VERY POSSIBLE THAT THE MOTHER HAD EXPERIENCED SOME FORM OF STARVATION WHEN SHE WAS CARRYING.

VAL>> YOU’RE TALKING ABOUT IMMIGRANTS COMING, SAY, FROM MEXICO?

GREG CRITSER>> YES, THAT’S RIGHT. SO WHAT YOU HAD IS A GROUP OF YOUNG CHILDREN WHO WERE INCLINED TO HOLD ONTO WEIGHT BECAUSE THEY HAD BEEN BORN SMALL. YOU PUT THAT SAME PERSON INTO AN ENVIRONMENT OF ENORMOUS PLENTY WHERE CHEAP FATS AND SUGARS ARE REALLY ALL OVER THE PLACE AND YOU HAVE A SITUATION THAT WE HAVE NOW WHERE YOU HAVE THE CHILDHOOD OBESITY RATE DOUBLING AND, IN SOME CASES, TRIPLING OVER THE CASE OF ABOUT TWENTY YEARS.

JESS>> AND WE CAN BLAME IT, AT LEAST IN PART, ON ANCESTRY AND CULTURE?

GREG CRITSER>> I THINK EVERYBODY HAS AN INCLINATION TO HOLD ONTO FAT. I MEAN, THAT’S OUR INHERITANCE FROM OUR CAVEMAN ANCESTORS. BUT WHAT HAS CHANGED IN THE LAST TWENTY YEARS IS NOT OUR GENETIC MAKEUP, BUT OUR ENVIRONMENT. FOR EXAMPLE, CALORIES USED TO BE RELATIVELY EXPENSIVE, BUT BECAUSE OF AGRICULTURAL POLICY IN THE 1970’S, WE CAME INTO A SITUATION WHERE CALORIES BECAME RELATIVELY CHEAP. THESE CALORIES ARE MAINLY MADE FROM CORN AND SOY BEANS AND THEY ARE THE CALORIES, SWEETENERS AND FATS THAT GO INTO CONVENIENCE FOODS, WHICH AS WE KNOW ARE ALL OVER THE PLACE.

THAT DOVETAILS WITH THE SECOND BIG REVOLUTION HAPPENING IN AMERICAN CULTURE AND THAT’S THE RISE OF THE TWO-INCOME FAMILY AND THE ABANDONMENT OF THE TRADITIONAL DAILY DINNER TABLES, SO PEOPLE EAT OUT MORE. EVEN IF THEY EAT OUT OFTEN, THEY THINK IT’S A TREAT AND THE FOOD THAT THEY GET WHEN THEY EAT OUT IS USUALLY SOMEWHERE AROUND TWO HUNDRED CALORIES MORE THAN IF THEY HAD COOKED THE SAME MEAL AT HOME, SO THAT’S THE OVERALL PICTURE.

VAL>> SO IT WAS A WHOLE COMBINATION OF THINGS. BUT YOU ALSO, IN YOUR BOOK, DEAL WITH THE MORALITY OF CONSUMPTION.

GREG CRITSER>> YES. THIS IS AN AREA WHERE THERE IS A LOT OF INTEREST BECAUSE, TRADITIONALLY WHEN IT COMES TO FOOD, THE ADVICE TO PARENTS HAS BEEN TO AVOID ANY DISCUSSION OF MORALITY ABOUT OVER-CONSUMPTION. IF YOU LOOK AT THE PARENTING MANUALS OF THE LATE 1970’S AND EARLY 1980’S AND EVEN TO A CERTAIN EXTENT TODAY, YOU WILL HEAR SOMETHING LIKE THIS. NEVER MAKE FOOD AN OBJECT OF DINNER TABLE DISCUSSION. DON’T TRY TO TELL A CHILD WHEN HE OR SHE IS EATING TOO MUCH FOOD BECAUSE THE IDEA IS THAT YOU WILL SOMEHOW STIGMATIZE THE CHILD, MAKE THE CHILD FEEL BAD AND END UP WITH ALL KINDS OF BODY IMAGE ISSUES. WHAT’S INTERESTING IS THAT WHAT WE KNOW NOW IS THAT, IF YOU COMPASSIONATELY EDUCATE A CHILD ABOUT WHAT’S TOO MUCH AND WHAT’S THE RIGHT KIND OF FOOD, NONE OF THAT STUFF HAPPENS AT ALL. IN FACT, THAT CHILD GOES OUT INTO SOCIETY WITH A KIND OF A MORAL BACKGROUND ABOUT THE FOOD HE OR SHE CHOOSES.

JESS>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH, GREG CRITSER. HERE’S ANOTHER LOOK AT THE BOOK CALLED “FAT LAND: HOW AMERICANS BECAME THE FATTEST PEOPLE IN THE WORLD”.

VAL>> TOMORROW ON LIFE AND TIMES, A HIGH-TECH WAY OF RESPONDING TO BURGLAR ALARMS WITHOUT ALWAYS SENDING FOR THE POLICE, BUT IS IT WORTH THE COST TO YOUR PRIVACY?

>> IF WE SEE PEOPLE WITH HANDGUNS WALKING AROUND THE INSIDE OF A BANK OR A JEWELRY STORE, WE’RE GOING TO HAVE A SENSE OF NOT ONLY WHAT THEY LOOK LIKE, BUT WHAT THEY LOOK LIKE WHEN THEY’RE COMING OUT OF THE BUILDING. WE DON’T ALWAYS KNOW THAT NOW.

VAL>> A REMINDER TO CHECK OUT OUR WEBSITE AT KCET.ORG FOR THE LATEST ON LIFE AND TIMES, AND WE THANK YOU FOR BEING PART OF OUR GROWING AUDIENCE.

JESS>> AND THAT’S TONIGHT’S BROADCAST. NOW FOR ALL OF US HERE AT LIFE AND TIMES, THANKS FOR JOINING US AND GOOD NIGHT.

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